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• Hello!

Say what you like, you all know eating meat is wrong. Its a waste of resources. cruel , barbaric and evil. How can we say that we are good and morale when you see the conditions of factory farming?
the only reason to eat meat is for the tase, the pleasure, so meat eaters kill animals and keep them in filthy conditions, pump them with steroids so that they cannot even walk, and eat them just for pleasure.
I have not eaten meat for 5 years, i look and feel great, could beat most of you in a run or weight lifting, so what the hell do you need to eat meat for?

y? because you and your grandad always have?

then why don't we bring back slavery and more sexism and treat the poor worse, and hangings and put thelegal age of consent back to 10 years old just as it was 100 years ago!!!

all these thing are barbaric, we have changed a lot for the better and many people disagrees with these changes. Are that kind of person?

Think about it properly!
Think for yourself!
Do you really believe that eating meat purely for pleasure at the expence of cruelty is right?


I have nothing against eating meat for survival, but that is not the case for anyone who reads this! and you know it!

But man cannot survive on Kebab shop salad alone!!!!

so what the hell do you need to breath air for??????

y? because you and your grandad always have???????????????????????



killing vegetables is cruel!

Actually I thought eating animals was good, I mean if we were vegetarians, there would be very few chickens, pigs etc still alive and as maddox says often you do realise that eating just wheat kills loads of animals in the harvesting etc.

To be honest If we were all meat eaters and not vege's alot more creatures would survive, I mean these ones under the harvester blades are not being eaten, they are not being bred again hence the reason for the harvest mouse nearly becoming sick.

Also if we were all vegetarians they will have a big shortage of vegetables in the winter and we would have to resort to meat anyway, but all the meat would be extinct so we will have to kill and eat the peoplewho all made us vegetarians

Yes eating meat means that animals that would otherwise not, do exist.

but seriously is that a valid point?

they are keptin the most unimaginable factory farming conditions, pumped with chemicals so that they are ready for harvest when only a few months old. Is that really a life?
why create life just for suffering?
there would be no shortage of vegies. we don't live in the dark ages! there are many kinds of modern storage! plus much of the world such as south america, africa, Australia all have harvests when the northern hemisphere is in winter. Not to mention all the countries that do not have a real winter.

meat is for pleasure! Animals suffer for pleasure. We don't have to change everything in our world! but y not change the bad things?

Killing vegies is cruel?

lets b mature here.
I know that instead of facing the reality of the question, people have to throw in dumb reasons to eat meat. Because there is no real reason to. Say wahat you like. But do u really think it is right

that is all i ask

do as you please

but know what you do

Where's Chay when you need him?

Read and weep hypocrite.

I do agree in some ways. I don't think we ought to eat meat, and the argument that animals would not exist if it was not for meat is quite a silly one. Of course they'd still exist. There'd probably be less cows if we weren't breeding them for food, but it's not like there'd be no animals at all.

Personally, I choose not to eat meat because I can survive perfectly well without it. I really ought to make more of an effort to convince people that this is the right thing to do, but vegetarians who cuss people bad because they eat meat can be really really annoying. I'd like to think I'm doing the right thing, and it would be cool if people could follow my example, but I'm not going to force them or anything. Saying that, it's also really annoying when someone's a total self-righteous meat eater and says stuff like "We were, like, designed to eat meat. I mean, look at our teeth."

Pastor lex0013,

I appreciate and hear your concerns. However, for one to effectively encourage meat eaters (numbers of which on the site I do not know) to be PURSUADED to CONSIDER becoming vegetarian, you need firstly to learn how to talk the arse off a donkey. It is something that we decide ourselves, like giving up smoking or (dare I say it) listening to MJ.

I know the conditions in factory farming etc are pretty gross in 'the west' and in fact, from age 13 I was a veggie, vegan even (until I couldnt find anything to eat), but when I hit 28, my whole outlook changed. Admittedly, by then I was living in Africa where the whole veggie thing is almost unheard of*, unless maybe you are Hindu, or you cannot afford meat. Had I still been living in UK, maybe I would not have made the decision to start eating meat again.

(*ever invited Africans to dinner and told them there is no meat? Dosent go down too well!)

My reasons for changing were because after eating meat, especially chicken, (my fav) I had a lot more energy (I had 5 horses at the time and rode each one every day) to do the things I wanted to do. Had I stayed a veggie, I would not have had enough stamina to do that in this heat. Also, another time when I craved meat, but chose fish, was when I was pregnant. What I am trying to say is, that vegetables alone cannot supply all the proteins needed to live a healthy life, some, yes, but not all. Or put another way, I got hungry.


"I have nothing against eating meat for survival, but that is not the case for anyone who reads this! and you know it!

err, actually I spent about 3 hrs last weekend trying to catch a couple of chickens in my yard for my guests to enjoy.......

hear hear doc, well said

Yes I believe eating vegetarians would save killing a few more animals therefore asving a few more.

As what Vic posted You kill animals eating whatever.

And yes I believe eating animals is right, that is what our bodies are made to eat, yes we can eat vegetables aswell, but our bodies do not deal with it aswell as it does meat. Vegetarians are almost always weak pale people, who long for meat. DO you think The Vikings/Romans/Barbarians/any conquering empire, before we all had automatic guns could have done what they did with weak vegetarians?

I personally do not want to see the extinction of quite a few domesticated species of animals aswell, do you think we will still breed these animals waisting money when we have absuse for them?

you know what, I think a mirror is needed.

Pastor lex0013,

can you get someone to read your post to you, then put it in your diary or something, because what you have said is unique to you, but not for PUSHING onto others

no offence meant

Beargod, that's a terrible argument. There are some reasonable arguments for eating meat, but you didn't include any of them there. Simply;

- vegetarians are almost always weak and pale.
- our bodies don't deal with vegetables well
- if we didn't eat meat there'd be no sheep / cows / pigs at all
- conquering empires ate meat, therefore we should eat it to be strong.

Show me one bit of evidence to support any of those claims.

I'd like to think I'm quite healthy and I certainly don't long for meat. But my friend Anna who has never eaten meat in her life sure could kick the collective asses of more or less anyone, including the roman empire. She hardcore!

The question is a moral one - humans are designed (sorry Doc) to eat meat - we're predators.
Also, lately, research has found a vegetarian diet not to be as healthy as originally thought.

If you want to make some sort of stand, but like a good lump of steak like I do, just never, ever eat at McDonalds, who are the worst (food-related) offenders of the planet imaginable.

There would be plenty of cows (for milk) and sheep (for wool), but I think pigs would be a zoo animal at best.

We are not predators! Where did you get that crazy idea from? We're hunter gatherers, if you're going back to some kind of evolutionary explaination. Which means, we can hunt and/or gather. And you do become slightly more at risk of stuff like ME from a vegetarian only diet, but you become so much less at risk from all kinds of heart conditions and cancer of the colon from a vegetarian only diet, it's generally considered to be worth the risk.

Sorry doc, I did say our bodies are not meant for it, but our bodies I remember in Biology that when we eat vegetables all we do is suck out the vitamins and what have you, then is goes to our poo hole where as meat we use the fat to give us more energy, salt and sugar and the majority of the meat for keeping us going, etc

I only eat chicken. Chickens are ugly.

What, like all those other animals? Wolves? Non-edible pigs? Birds of prey? So what?

I won't be thinking, oh, those poor pigs! Yes, there'll be less of them, but I think the huge oversized pig population isn't really a major worry. They haven't been introducing the Pig One Child Policy lately, have they? I'd rather have a small amount of non-bred-for-food pigs than a load that we just kill and eat, no?

No, most of it just sits around in your small intenstine and makes fecal matter.

Um, eyes at the front? Sharp teeth?

I eat meat and I enjoy it - this is true
Factory farming causes suffering to animals - Im no chicken but sure, ok, if you say so
In this day and age, where we can store fruit and vegetables all year round, there is no need for us to eat meat - Again, I'll take your word for it.

The real question is do I care? - not one fucking bit

Sorry. I just dont. I like meat and as long as its legal and safe to do so I will eat it at great leisure.

I am not sure we would keep sheep for wool, cos when was the last time you went clothes shopping to buy wool, sheep cannot protect themselves.

If we were vegetarians we possibly might stop having milk and eggs, and therefore no use for these animals.

Pigs could make good house pets but that is about it.

Yes they might survive, they might not, we won't look after them and I excpect the farmers will use their fields for other things so we will kill alot by them just going to their old paddocks and fields to protect the farms business.

Also we will be harvesting more, and more creatures will be killed from the harvesters and the futer great big mechanical stawberry pickers.

Why?

Because if we eat vegetables, what is the point in keeping cows when the majority of the money they get from keeping cows is from slautering and selling the meet? It would be alot cheaper to have a field of soya and make Soya milk, It probably is cheaper now aswell.

Eggs, I am not sure of a replacement for that yet,but I am sure they would think of a cheaper way of getting the same results

Soya milk is fucking disgusting!

You what? You think that more money can be made by killing a cow once than from selling it's milk for up to fifteen years?

Beargod, do you know anything about this subject?

I know it is Sul but I am allergic to normal milk, you get used to it eventually, and new borns won't know any difference, although I can't see them drinking a mugs of soya milk, as i used to do with normal milk

Erm Pauly, yes ok they will produce alot of milk, but they might take a while to have a baby if they do and when they stop having babies and producing milk, what then, do they Kill it so they don't have to look after it for alot longer and spend more money on vets and feeding then they got on keeping it alive? Isn't the whole point in doing this to "pointlessly" kill animals? This will be killing it more pointlessly then killing it for food.

Also Won't these cows be in a worse situation then before with the fact farmers will give them less space so the farmers can produce more food out of plants?

I hate milk. It comes out of cows tits.

Yuk.

It comes out of where?! :O

farmers have to yank on the cows tits to get the milk out of them.

Yuk.

I wouldn't touch a glass of milk with a shitty stick. It makes me gag.

The farmers have to do what?! :O

hehe

Im off to buy a nice fur coat.

The farmers suck cows tits and spit the milk into a dirty bucket Sul :)

As I said you absorb the vitamins and poo the rest you do not keep any of it stoed in your body for useful reasons

Humans are omniverous, we are designed to eat a varied diet and there are many proteins and good stuff in meat that are vital for the health of your body.

Be a vegetarian if you want, doesnt bother me, but dont force your beliefs on me! GIMME BACK MY BACON ROLL!

Ummm, I think the point has got a bit distracted. I wasn't suggesting that the whole world ought to become vegetarian. If there is an objective moral position, then I reckon it is on the side of vegetarianism. It would be nice if more people did become vegetarian, but there's not going to be a sudden transition. Even BSE and all that jive didn't affect it.. it's not going to happen any time soon.

Pauly, oh yes. Eyes at the front? A couple of pointed teeth? Like apes, those well known predators.

And it's such a bizarre argument that the world can't become vegetarian or we'd run out of cows. It doesn't make any sense. Surely they'll still have cows and sheep and that until there isn't any demand for their products. So whilst there's still a demand for beef and milk, there'll be cows. And if suddenly everyone starts having soya milk and no beef, then yes, there won't be that many cows. Not many people eat wolves, so there aren't many wolves. No demand for them, no?

Also, an argument claiming that "we were designed to do x" seems to completely go against the idea of civilisation. We were designed to adapt to our circumstances, perhaps. But seeing as we don't need meat to survive, it seems quite unusual to claim we were designed to eat meat.

I don't want to come across like I'm cussing anyone bad for eating meat. I'm just claiming that your arguments for objecting to vegetarianism are really really bad. If you want to eat meat, that's fine. I'm not going to stop you.

Unless they put me in charge of the world, that is.

also, what happens if vegetables get diseases and all die off? Like they say is happening to bannanas with selective breeding? What then? You vegetarians will be in trouble then, and then guess who will be laughing, ha not you thats for sure!

By the way, this is the sort of disagreement which starts wars, now stop it before Beargod gets the anthrax out again!

Yes, that's true. The fact that they won't be able to make any more bananas will kill all of us vegetarians stone dead.

Good god. I'd better stock up whilst I still can. I don't want to be fighting people like Chandler for the last packet of Quorn Burgers. Ohh no.

Yeah Anthrax!

Steel shattered in the night
Soldiers racing to the fight
Bombs waiting to explode
Fear is cast up on your soul
Wooh!

"You're mighty brave in cyberspace, flame boy."

I am not saying you cannot be vegetarians. I just like meat too much, it keeps me healthy and energetic and tastes much better then any Vegetable or meat substitute I have had.



Dude why did we nearly kill off the wolves? cos they ate and attacked our food, (many of us aswell, but that is a different story). These Wild farm creatures will also need to eat, they eat lots more then we do in a meal, they eat the same things we do mostly, where are they going to go for food? The farmers fields, will the farmers like animals taking their food/money? Have they ever? What do farmers use to stop pests eating their food? Death is the usual and best option, just like the wolves

Ummm. Death to the wolves!

You can't really imagine men in red coats chasing a cow across the landscape cause they prey on the Farmer's grass....

I can't imagine a load of Butlins staff chasing wolves either :P

"Diane... It's 3:06pm and Beargod has found another subject to know little about"

;)

"DAMN! this coffee is good!"

Who is Diane?

And why do I not know about it? Most of what I said will most likely happen.

Only joking BG....

I had a Twin Peaks marathon at my house t'other day. Really got into it again. Although I'm a tad pissed off that you can't yet get the second season onwards on DVD. Cunts.

I never saw it

Aw, it's fucking ace. That and Patrick McGoohan's "The Prisoner" are my two favourite serieseseses.

I never got round to watching the prisner When the repeatse were on about 5 to 10 years ago, but yet again I always missed it

The last episode of that was the best thing ever. Completely hatstand, it was.

Where he met number one?

Was the writters of that always on drugs?

more than likely.

Fo some reason I thought that was Dangerman :/

I have never heard of dangerman

It was an unofficial spinoff from Dangerman. It was (of sorts) a pet project of McGoohan. He left Dangerman to write, star and produce The Prisoner, which on watching it brings me to the conclusion that he is a complete mentalist.

(It was filmed 2 miles away from my house in Wales too)

So I was sort of right. I can live with being nearly correct.

"Number Six" is also generally considered to be one and the same as the main character in Dangerman.

"Where's Chay when you need him?"

I'm here! but ive overridden my "Vegetarian Smug Chip" so i don't feel the need to get into this tedious discusion :)

Yeah chay agrees with me, he just don't like the taste :D

just a little point that i think a few people are a little oblivious too.

Animals eat crops. DOH
so if all the vegis (crops) got diseases i think we would probably all die, even you Murderers.
Twice as much land is needed for meat, as you need land to grow the food for the animals and land for the animals.
Logic sugests that if we were all vegie, then less land needed = more land for wild or whatever + less animals killed in harvesting, because less harvesting.
as for all that stuff about veggies being pale and meek, well i happened to see some photos of you so called warrior predator weak ass's and believe me you look more like the prey to me!
anytime ya fat over indulged murderers!
And as i've said , I have nothing against meat for survival, and if you are a real predator, then go with my blessing!
ummm i dont think going to the butcher's counter in tesco is quite the same thing.

As for the guy in Africa, Don't worry mate I know what you mean, think it would be real tough for anyone to be vegy over there, still what about being Hindu? got some cool gods!

C ya
Alex

As for the guy in Africa, Don't worry mate

hahahahahahah

I wanna eat meat, and butter and buckets of cheese.....I've seen the future, and you know what it is? It's a 60 year old virgin sitting by the pool, sipping broccoli shakes......

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm......... meat.

Jeffid, surely that should go in the "What's going to happen in 100 years time" thread.

Not that it would make any sense there either.

This was also cool.

"as for all that stuff about veggies being pale and meek, well i happened to see some photos of you so called warrior predator weak ass's and believe me you look more like the prey to me! anytime ya fat over indulged murderers!"

My god. That's the most harshest vegetarian-led cussing I've ever heard. I've never seen dietary matters taken to such an extreme.

Still, I guess it serves you warrior predator weak ass's right for calling vegetarians weak and pale.

I didn't call them weak and pale. i called them hypocritical SOB's. (present company excepted of course)

No, it was BG who said that the roman army would never have conquered Europe on a diet of broccoli and yams. But yeah. Aaaanyway.

This is all media conditioning again. If the newspapers and television and books and the internet etc hadnt shown you what condition these animals were kept in you wouldnt all be sentimental fucking hippies now.



hehehe :)

Hehehe.. it's true.. before the arise of mass media, there were no vegetarians.

In fact, I think they burned them at the stake. Or is that steak?

Actually, thinking about that, it's pretty strange.. the advances in corporate mass media actually means there are more hippies.

That's well hectic.

So basically you mean that because media has shown us the truth, we should blame medie
hmm that makes secence

its much better if we did not know anything, and made no decisions.

come on.
please someone come up with a serious argument



the bets i've heard is just cause you love the taste. which is fine, cause thats what i always say, its pleasure at the expence of barbaric death factory sickness.

but i'm sure you'll find lots of rapists and Paedophiles who totally agree that there pleasure is worth others suffering.
Are meat eaters any different to someone who kicks his dog to death because he enjoys the power trip?

please i'm waiting for a serious reason to eat meat

Went To France?!!!!

why don't you search the site for 'vegetarian' that should provide with you with what you are looking for.

(apart from the good slapping)

I dont want to even try to think of a reason to get you to eat meat. Its your choice not mine.

As for the following:
"Are meat eaters any different to someone who kicks his dog to death because he enjoys the power trip?"

That's just daft so Im going to reply with:

Are vegetarians just people who get off on stomping the moral high ground on their moral high horses?

or 'Do you get the necessary iron from semen?'

mmmm irony

My god. I can't believe I just got cussed for blaming Hippies on the media. That was Sul!
I don't think anyone was seriously suggesting that we blame the media.

If it's any consolation, I agree with you. We shouldn't eat meat. But there are other things we shouldn't do,

oh man i can't actually be bothered.
here are my arguments in point form

- objective (unknowable) moral truth, right?
- been there done that
- rapists / paedophiles slightly different case. strange but it is. whilst there's a law that suggests humans are more important than animals that's just the case. you can't imagine that if the News of the World ran a big sheet of butchers people'd go attack them like they do with paedophiles (by the way, did anyone see the wife-beaters on the sun today?)
- hush, dear boy, hush.

Yes, causing suffering to animals is wrong. But there are better ways to stop it than trying to persuade a load of beef-chewing people on a message board. Go set fire to a slaughterhouse or something. Or free some cattle. That'd make a statement that people would actually notice.

I'm sorry cause I normally have a lot of sympathy for millitant vegetarians, but you do seem severely mental.

Kindest regards.

Doc.

Actually cows love to be eaten. love it they do.
If you don't believe me watch (or read) 'The Restaurant at the end of the Universe'

Hey I have an idea, why don't we stop eating meat to save a couple of animals, instead lets just build over other animals homes and kill them off, lets build lots of factories and power stations and pollute the air and lots of food, heck I am a vegetarian to save animals yet I kill them, usually in worse cases because I do not know about it as much as I do about eating food. As they say come off your high horse get over it, your a vegetarian to prevent one or two animals being looked after badly and killed poorly get over it, you do alot worse unless you are a hermit who lives in a cave with no heating and no electricity, I bet you also have things like eggs milk or wool from these creatures anyway, so you are also basically putting these poor animals through the same thing anyway you are just not eating them

"the bets i've heard is just cause you love the taste"

didnt know we were betting, but I thought I had given a clear enough explanation

I also said that when I was pregnant, I craved different proteins

then you said the man in Africa

YOU DIDNT READ MY POST PASTOR!!!

RedAndWhiteMan says: Vegetarians (with the honorable exceptions Dr Lucid/Uncle Moc and Chandler) suck donkey balls.

I would have said "with the honorable exceptions Dr Lucid/Uncle Moc and redmaiden" cos chandler is just weird

Ummm...

Beergoad, much as I respect you for taking on the entire establishment of English Spelling and Grammar single handedly, you are talking some kind of crazy talk.

I don't think you can deny that it's morally better not to kill animals than to kill animals. As if (ceteris paribus) you choose the former, then there is less suffering in the world. However, it's more morally better not to kill animals or drink milk and eat eggs, etc. And so vegetarians are hardly morally superior. They merely make a choice not to eat meat. You can't say "You're darn hypoctites" just because they don't have perfect moral standards. No-one has perfect moral standards.

Oh, and RedandWhiteMan, all non-vegetarians eat donkey balls! (metaphorically speaking)

RedandWhiteMan could you add Reddy to the honorable exceptions?

cheers

Uncle Moc I know people are not superialy morally better its just these jackasses like lex0013 who say that everyone becoming vegetarians in the world will improve everything, when there are millions of cases that we do not think about which do alot worse. And if its the case of the fact we treat them really badly when these creatures are alive, just becoming vegetarian will not be good enough, we will have to give up alot more cos they will still treat animals in the same way to get your eggs and milk etc. If it is the slaughter house opinion, that is just dumb, we do worse to vegetables :)

If your a christian,it is ok to eat meat and hence it is not barbaric in the christian mind. I think its all a matter of opinions. What about when you pull a carrot from its root, arent you killing it? I do eat meat but not alot, I eat mostly fish because it is low in fat. But I do understand what your saying how they "torture" certain animals so they can be bigger in size,smell,etc. It may be cruel in your opinion but to others its ok.

Also does anyone on this board have pets? Like dogs,cats,etc..? If so why don't people eat their dogs or eat another dog? Maybe one day I will become a vegetarian but for right now I think meat is addictive like a cigarette and it is a must have for some reason.

cicagrett :D

So I spelled it wrong. Sue me. cigarette

. Vegetarians are almost always weak pale people, who long for meat. DO you think The Vikings/Romans/Barbarians/any conquering empire, before we all had automatic guns could have done what they did with weak vegetarians?
------------------
First of all your wrong! There are plenty of pale and weak meat eaters you genius. Why the heck would you even want to conquer another race? Romans,greeks, where all barbarians. And I guess what your saying is in order to win wars or to conquer people (kill innocent people for no reason)we need to eat meat? Shut the fuck up you idiot.

waves goodbye to rtcw32. you are outtahere!

If you hurry you can change to the MJ threads and tell us how much you love his sprem.

I think it is cowardly to kill a defenseless cow. If you got such balls trying killing a lion, with your bear hands you pussy. Yes I eat meat, but I also have alot of fears. To say vegetarians are weak and fearful people is ridiculous.

Hahaha..
[i own you - chandler]

oh rtcw32 i am a vegetarian
you moron

[sigh]

In reponse to who ever said veggies are pale. Jefferey dahmer looked very pale to me! And so does Michael jackson!

reponse?

what a twat he was

amen mr beargod, amen

So can a vegan eat sprem? Cause it's going to contain cells?

I so don't have the energy to argue.

SPREM! ANAS!

No - if they do then, by definition, they aren't vegans any more.